Metamatic Forums John Foxx John Foxx Quiet City website updates...

11.10.07

I thought I'd start a thread in which I can post every time I update my Quiet City website - albeit it's not that frequent!

Anyway, the first of a couple of updates have just been done.

I have updated the news section, several of the album pages, and I have added Retro Future and Metal Beat to the discography.

I have also changed the layout very slightly by getting rid of the white lines. They were starting to feel a bit boxy and restrictive, so I have set it all free!

However there are a few typographical glitches that seem to be beyond my control, mainly the leading. I build my website (rather clumsily) in QuarkXpress. Looks fine on screen... then I export it and all the text has squashed up! I'm yet to find a way around this, so you'll just have to bear with me. And because I do it on a mac I have no idea how it looks on a PC, so fingers crossed for the best results!

Anyway, I'm hoping to get new photos and stories etc uploaded over the next week...

www.quietcity.co.uk

I've just sppotted some stray text in the menu on the news page! Why do I always spot these things when I'm at work and unable to do anything about it?!

Quark?? I coverted to InDesign two years ago.
Much more lovely...

I work in both.

I have to work in Quark in my day job. But last year I converted to InDesign at home. And it is vastly superior

I'm still trying to convince my manager to change to InDesign....

But when I came to make the site, I already knew how to make a basic webpage in Quark, rather than learning how to do it from scratch in InDesign (if you can?), so it was the quicker, easier solution!

Quark? InDesign? Pah! I work in Notepad. Only raw CSS and XHTML is good enough for me.

*does 3 million press ups and punches self in stomach to demonstrate hardness*

Notepad,you dont know you were born.

When I were a young I.T. lad i used to edit websites using Unix VI...that was painful....

Notepad?
I used to dream of working in Notepad...

Rob

Hmm. Looks like I'm gonna have to start a new thread in which I can post every time I update my website!

I hereby rename this one the "what do you make websites in" thread!

Hi Alex,
The Quiet City looks good on Windows PC.

You certainly have put together a good and informative site.

Well done

Peter

Thanks Peter - I really like the photo of John you took at Cargo

Who'da thought twenty year ago, that we'd sitting round 'ere making websites in 'Indesign' - I remember working 28hrs a day in front of cardboard box, with wooden blocks for keyboards and a spike for a mouse, and my boss you'd to whip me until I cried - and that were if I got it right!!
Cheers

Ha - luxury! There were 150 of us working on a notepad in the middle of the M1; we'd get up fifteen hours before went to bed, would turn on our PCs before we'd cleaned our teeth - with coal by the way - work 36 hour day in front of the screen, toiling over things that people wouldn't understand for less pay than the average postal worker, and then go home, collapse, where Father would cut our muffins and eat them before our eyes with Earl Grey, while jumping up and down on a spike singing 'bloody hallelujah'...

And you tell that to the kids today, etc.




LG
x

InDesign for me! Your site looks great Alex..........

Thanks

I've repaired the glitch on the news page now.

Done a few more updates... mainly the news page and extended reviews of Metamatic, The Garden, Shifting City and TPOE.

Due to helping my neighbour out with his new adorable kitten, I didn't get the updates I had hoped to do this weekend.

So hopefully coming soon:

- Quiet City's 1st Birthday: Foxx fans share their memories
- Metamatic 2007 tour reviews and photos (which you'll all have seen on here anyway!)
- more revised album reviews

More site updates...

Okay! Done a bit more

I have revised/extended the reviews for Metamatic, The Garden, The Golden Section, Shifting City, The Pleasures of Electricity and Sideways. More to come soon (hopefully!). It's hard to avoid bias in writing reviews... obviously I AM biased! But anyway trying to remain critical yet maintain an overall positive and informative light.

Golden Moments
Thanks to everyone who has sent me things to include - some of your stories are now online.

Anybody who wishes to write something for the "Golden Moments" page, please do get in touch, and I'll add it to the page. If I get a lot more content, I'll probably re-design or index that page (as well as re-write my lousy intro!).

The next thing I'm hoping to do is upload photographs and reviews from the Metamatic shows....

I also updated the news page with a bit of info on Tiny Colour Movies in Leeds and a link to the Townsend Records Foxx page, so people can buy John's CDs at a sensible price!

That's quite an interesting reason to put down Alex as I've always found Amazon a slightly more sensible price on all releases than Townsend Records, plus they have a wider choice. But, hey-ho...

It's not my intention to tell people where to buy John's music – otherise I'd have to start listing hmv.co.uk, amazon, music-non-stop etc.

Townsend seems to be the obvious choice for the moment anyway, since they have their dedicated page for John's music.

Ok, I kind of agree, but I thought your site was to chronicle John's work and provide an interesting and accurate source of information for other fans. If it's not your intention to tell people where to go to buy the music, why pick Townsend out specifically - why not put all the other sites you've mentioned with the appropriate links so that people can make their own choice?

You don't work for Amazon, do you?

I have actually pondered over the idea of listing online retailers - probably in the links section. Specialist places such as Sister Ray, MNS and Townsend deserve more of a mention that Amazon or HMV in my opinion.

That said, John's music is much easier to get hold of nowadays, than it was when I first got into it, when it seemed quite rare and obscure. Of course people are capable of making their own choices – I guess that link just acts as a starting point.

Anyway, the link is not a permenant fixture. I thought that the two 'tour' CDs being sold on there was a good enough reason to include it at this present time.

Made a few more tweaks last night to the album pages:

- bigger album covers and other images
- added a scan of the front of "The Church" to The Garden page.

Can anybody help me out with scans of the 2 Nation 12 single sleeves?

Alex
Your Quiet City site is looking really fantastic. The design and layout work to real advantage in it's really easy to navigate around. I know you've put a lot of work, time and effort into it and I've seen it grow over the year.
Top marks and please continue the good work.

Peter

Thanks Peter.

I've done some more updates - that'll probably be it until after Tiny Colour Movies in Leeds.

- Scan of the Golden Section Tour lyric booklet added to the album page
- Scans of the 2 Nation 12 singles added to the album page
- Sarah & Phil and Brian's live photos have been added
- Garry's Cargo review and photos have been added
- New Golden Moments homepage; in which Peter, Martin and Chris C now have a page of their own for their stories!

Cheers Alex,nice to see all of the pictures up.

Your sites looking excellent as ever.

Brian

Thanks Brian

I do like some of the photos you took at Brum. Very atmospheric. I'm happy to have them on the site. You might notice a couple of yours in the new banner graphic on the news page too.

I'm pleased with the content of the site now. Don't feel I want to add much more to it, other than obviously, when new stuff comes out.

Still a few of the albums I need to re-review, but now that I've got extra graphics on most pages, I'm pretty happy wth it.

After a brief spell offline, Quiet City is now back with the following updates:

A new home page.

New tracklistings and a brief overview for The Garden, The Golden Section and In Mysterious Ways have been added.

Pages and reviews for Impossible and Neuro Video have been added

The links have been updated.

And the discography has been re-designed to accommodate John's uncontrollable output!

There's a few bits & pieces to iron out and there is more new content and exciting stuff to come, hopefully soon.

A very tasteful homepage, and the Mirror image is good

I get a 404 on that link.

That link changed I think - all on the Camera page.

...Though that entire page might change soon!

Not been to your site for months, too busy, but will look at the updates soon!!

I'll have to keep an eye out.

Excellent work Alex - thanks.

Thanks

I thought that picture was the most appropriate choice with Glimmer having recently been released.

Nice website Alex. I really like, well, everything about the site, especially the From Trash section which has loads of articles that I've never ever seen before.

Keep up the good work.

Cheers

Antoinette

Hi Alex

You done a wonderful work! It is a pleasure to watch all sections! I can imagine this was a hard work.....!
Thanks for it.

, Andreas

Is the Jade background colour of the homepage a direct reference to the Shifting City album cover colour? marking the starting point of Johns return to his core music and the online interest surrounding him now

Yes, you are absolutely right!

Shifting City was one of the first JF albums I bought (I think it was the fourth, to be precise!), so that album and it's imagery was an important thing for me, and I always associate that colour scheme with John's music - strange though it may sound. I never imagined the website any other way.

I see the discography with the highlightable covers is static now. Overall some great updates and still keeping within the original design is good.

Yes, I'm sad I had to ditch the rollovers in the disgography

When I have more time, I may reintroduce small album cover icons, perhaps in rows of 3 rather than 2, although that would mean redesigning every page to accommodate a wider section, unless they are really tiny. I reluctantly opted for text only for ease of updates, plus with the rollover icons growing, my site was gradually becoming slower and slower to work with.

It's John's fault! Too many new releases!!

Too many releases Alex Never

Just visited and read your updates for Quiet City. Although I miss the little icons I can fully understand your reason for using text.

Your reviews for Glimmer, Impossible and Nuero Video and nicely summed up in a nutshell.

Quiet City is an outstanding tribute to John solo career and his career with Louis. You've put a lot of time and effirt into Quiet City and it looks very professional.

Peter

I have just uploaded my review of the Quiet Man in Leeds, with photos (courtesy of our very own Brian).

Someone almost there...

Thanks for the excellent review Alex. And thank you Brian for the photos. Enjoyed both immensely.

Nice touch Alex - thanks.

I'm interested in the connection you've identified between 'A Man made of Shadows' and 'Tiny Colour Movies'?

How do you see that working?

Nice link between Quiet City and The Quiet Man. A feeling of deja-vu I guess.

Chris

Great review Alex.

Like the Quitecity makeover as well

Great stuff.

Brian

When I saw John perform TCM at the Leeds Film festival last year, there was a short non-album film called "A Man Made of Shadows".

The same footage was used during the film of the same name on Friday - obviously more clips of the same kind; mostly black and white, 50s Americana type stuff. Cities, headlights, smart suits, an elusive woman and a mysterious central character whose face we almost see.

I think perhaps this was originally a new piece developed for TCM, but it seems to have evolved into part of the Quiet Man project.

As I said in my review, this project seems to bring all of John's film and music work together - the Quiet Man connected at some point to every aspect of his work.

Fascinating stuff.

Nice review thanks Alex

www.quietcity.co.uk

To coincide with John's latest and up coming releases, I have completely redesigned my Quiet City website.

This has also been a personal exercise for me as it is the first time I have built a site using Dreamweaver and Flash. I hope this will make it more robust and reliable in any platform and browser (tests so far have been successful...). But there may still be clunky bits or things which don't quite work, so if you come across something, let me know as it all looks fine at my end!

It has been designed however, for best viewing on a screen resolution of 1024 or greater, and you'll need the latest Flash player for the homepage.

There have been a few changes... The 'Camera' section is no more (any future picture galleries will go in the Plaza section), and I have also removed the archive - at least for now.

I have just added a page for My Lost City and all being well, should have a new interview coming soon.

Anyway, I hope you like it.

I liked the old design, inspired by the original Cathedral Oceans and Shifting City covers, but this is certainly more in line with the last several years of Foxx covers. Looks good.

That discography page really brings home just how far things have come from the old days when all we had was the first three Ultravox LPs and the four Virgin albums, though, doesn't it?

Not bad Alex but,The 2 original Omidelic Exotour and Drive EP covers are missing.

They're all featured on the related album pages, so the 2 original Exotour covers are here:
http://www.quietcity.co.uk/discog/exotour.html

And The Drive is with Crash & Burn:
http://www.quietcity.co.uk/discog/crash_and_burn.html

I liked the old design too but felt a change was needed, plus the site was becoming unmanageable because of how I'd put it together.

You're right about the discography though - it's huge! Ten years back, who would have thought it?!

I saw them there, Alex but, The one you featured, "The Golden Section Tour Plus Ominidelic" isn't actually a compilation of the previous two issues, it features many remixed versions of the original issue tracks, they merit a mention in they're own right otherwise why have the original Cathedral Oceans cover along with the reissue of I & II?

Just spent an enjoyable 1/2 hour looking though Quiet City. Your updated site is certainly impressive and before I read the comments on Metamatic just now I realised just how far John as come since the "Virgin Days".

The enlarged scans of the album covers in the discograhy section and your unbiased veiws certainly made interesting reading.

Well done Alex.

Peter

They were different?! In what way?

Anyway it looks like I have my Exotour facts wrong, as I don't have either of the original Exotour CDs, so I had just assumed that the album version that came in the double set was a compilation of the two.

I had considered putting all 3 versions, but I did feel it would be a bit repetitive and would be much better to feature all 3 on one page. As I decided to make my discography list by album, I thought it best to include any singles and EPs under the relevant album section, with the Golden Section/Exotour pack being the most recent and still available 'version' of album.

So let me get this right... the First Exotour CD was just an EP, followed by the full album version the following year.

So how does the Golden Section Tour/Exotour album version differ from the 1998 CD version?

The version of Shifting City on Exotour 1997 is unique across the three releases. A couple of the tracks on The Omnidelic Exotour (most notably Hiroshima Mon Amour, The Quiet Men and The Noise) have been remixed (slightly) from their counterparts on the Subterranean Omnidelic Exotour .

Rob

I never knew that! Well, you learn something new every day ;-)

I'll look into rearranging this in a suitable way.

Can anybody send me a decent, unsigned version of the second Exotour cover? I have a mono version I can use in the meantime but it would be good to have a colour one.

Thanks!

Well done, Alex! Your site was always excellent, but the updated look and feel of it now is just so superior.

Just one very, very minor quibble, you've missed the second 'a' in 'City Of Disappearances' on the tracklisting on the latest news page. How trivial am I!! :rolleyes:

Ah, thanks! If there is a spellchecker in Dreamweaver, I haven't found it yet!!

Thanks Rob.

So, another version of Shifting City... I'd like to hear that. Is it radically different to the other?

Off the top of my head, there is no vocals in the coda, of the Ep version. i think the beginning is different on the full album version, and the double CD featuring the Omnidelic hybrid has several additions, such as intros and guitar stabs on other tracks, notably Quiet Men.
Wasn't dissing your site Alex, I think the redesign is very well done. I just thought the original issues deserved a place and not just a footnote.

Keep up the good work

No problem, I found your comments quite useful and I've taken them on board - when my server decides to respond, you'll see an even bigger discography!

OK - here we go!
Discography page

I've made pages for the individual Exotour albums and the Drive EP - which does add to the bigger picture (and bigger discography!). I always liked the covers though so it's nice to see them all together, although I still need a colour version of Exotour 98.

The image you have for the Exotour 1998 is incorrect - in fact there isn't an album called Exotour 1998. You're using the sleeve for the 'never released' stand-alone album The Exotour as featured in an article I wrote for Extreme Voice.

This album would eventually became half of The Golden Section Tour / The Omnidelic Exotour double CD set.

You need the artwork for the Subterranean Omnidelic Exotour instead.

Rob

Aaaah!!!!

Would you be able to furnish me with the correct version?

I'm suddenly feeling the frustration of missing out on these CDs!!

I'll get there eventually...

Hi Alex,

A couple of comments if I may. Apologies if this seems overly picky or negative as no offence is intended.

Impressions. While I'm sure you've spent masses of time on your redesign, the first image that arrives on the screen when accessing is the man walking over the bridge. This is far too close to what Rob has done here on Metamatic , so that just seems a bit odd, and almost a tad ungrateful, given that you're able to promote your site as a guest here. Likewise, if you explore some of the pages at Metamatic, you'll see Rob has done some wonderful things with a black background twist to the white concept and design he has, so again, it's slightly derivative of something that's already been done.

Credit where credit's due. I appreciate some of the photos you've used are either from various releases or sourced from Rob and Metamatic, but I think you should be more specific on what they are, and who/where they were taken from, and also state this much closer to the images so that visitors can see for themselves what the source is. Having spent some time sourcing and licensing several images for publications over the past year or two (a sometimes lengthy and soul destroying process), just putting 'All images copyright John Foxx/Metamatic.com' on the front page is lazy. Additionally, given that you're using others work so openly, it's arguable whether your reasoning 'Quiet City is a John Foxx fan site, no infringement intended.' goes far enough. If you know what you're writing, and where images to be used are from, then help yourself not cause offence - intended or not - by spending some time to find out whether they're happy for the item to be used. If you can't locate the source, or be in a position to ask them, then don't use it. It's much better to do that than receive communication that will immediately put you on the back foot having to defend yourself.

Fonts and sizes, etc. It may be just me, but across your site, these all seem diferent in style, size and (ultimately) a bit jumbled and out of place when viewed next to each other. One of the beauties of John's designs, reflected here on Metamatic is the simplicity and elegance through the works. It's only my preference, but consistency and simplicity in design would help enormously for people navigating your site.

Discography. I appreciate you only have a fraction of the stuff Rob may have for any future Discography on Metamatic , but I think this is a bit weak and concentrates on your own personal preferences. Some of the smaller single sleeves are almost impossible to make out, so having those at a larger picture would give each release more interest, relevance and would not rely so heavily on your written assesments.

Reviews. Again, only my preference, but carefully editing some of the longer album reviews as they are would make them much easier to take in. Also, be consistent with your own views if that's what you want to put in. I notice sometimes in forum postings here on Metamatic , your comments on specifics are different to those you are willing to put on your own website. It's hard, but again, it will stop others thinking your aim is to be all things to all people if you think about what you may write on Quiet City before giving different judgements here .

Hope this gives you a few things to think about and helps improve the site.

All the best,


EG

Thank you for your comments EG - this sort of thing is always very useful, especially as it's very easy to become a bit too absorbed in something and omit the finer detail in places.

Credits: I think I had more information regarding image credits on the previous version of the site, and I do intend to integrate that back - but I felt the disclaimer currently there would be OK in the meantime while I get the majority of the site together, which is about where I am now. I certainly don't want to litter the site with credits everywhere but, like you say they do need to be a bit more specific in places.

With so many fan-made pages using uncredited photos, on sites like Facebook or MySpace, I think it is easy to let credit like this slip, which of course isn't good practice. I certainly wouldn't like to find one of my images appearing uncredited somewhere, so it's only fair that I respect this ideaology with John, Rob or anybody else in mind where necessary.

Fonts etc: This new design has been a bit (ok, a lot!) of a learning curve for me, as it is the first time I've done anything in Dreamweaver - which may account for the inconsistencies in fonts you are seeing. I'll have to look into this and perhaps work towards a more web-friendly typographical standard then the usual 2-3 styles I'm used to working with in printed publications.

One thing I'm unhappy with is the leading - it seems too tight, but I'm yet to determine how to change this...

Over all the bridges: First and foremost, this site is a personal project out of my own interest - but in turn also something that will help raise John's profile and hopefully provide information for people just discovering his work, along the way. However, the last thing I would ever want to do, is tread on Rob's toes and devalue in any way, the hard work that goes into the official site. So I do take on board what you are saying about the first image on the home page (which was actually supposed to be the last!). I do need to re-work that Flash animation anyway, as there is a horrid line that appears on the bottom half way through...

Reviews: It's tricky with reviews... especially as I'm often changing or tweaking the reviews as I grow to love various albums more than before, or in some cases grow to appreciate an album that maybe didn't grab me at all, at first.

On here I'll write in a more conversational, spontaneuos way. But for the site - as an information source - I want to make the reviews as unbiased as I can, but without completely removing my views, since it's my site after all. I can understand how that can appear to be hypocritical at times though, but, I do try to remain in agreement with myself!

I think it would be wrong to express only my opinions in reviews, because an album I dislike, somebody else will inevitably love! So while I do want to get my opinion across, I guess the trick is to try and strike the balance between a serious and realistic overview of an album with a bit of background information, combined with my take on it - but hopefully not in a way that could be maybe offputting or over persuasive.

Just out of interest, which reviews do you think are too long?

Singles: You're right... they are too small and the designs are not standing out as well as they should.

At a later stage I do intend to add tracklistings for the singles.


The joy with a project like this, is that it's constantly evolving, whether its my taste, John's output or the technical side.

Another nice thing about the new way I've done it, is that it's so much easier and quicker to update. I've just changed the Flash intro, swapping the bridge image with my favourite, the TPOE cover - although the old one might still be in your cache...

Another thing the discography needs and will get, is a 'previous' and 'next' album link on each album page. At least that's easier to do now all the pages are in place.

Its nice to see those new covers in the Discograthy section.I've never seen them before & was certainly not aware they existed.Nice work.

Ok, trying something new now - I have made separate pages dedicated to the single releases of John's first four albums. This is by no means a fully comprehensive discography, but a general guide as to each album's single releases - thanks to Peter for the scans.


Metamatic singles

The Garden singles

The Golden Section singles

In Mysterious Ways singles

Excellent Work Alex!!
Very professional!

Dancing Like A Gun cover is on it's side, Alex.
No One Driving was a double single too, with This City and Mr. No on Disc 2.

Then there is the 12" singles to take into account.

Good job though.

Just had a good look around the site. Great work Alex! I always enjoy reading your album reviews.

Not my copy.

If I were doing a John Foxx website I'd include the LP titled John Foxx and released in Canada with half the tracks from Metamatic and various other songs ( as described here ), but outside of Canada it didn't likely have any impact at all, and it was never issued on CD. Still, it was my first John Foxx LP, purchased a year and a bit after I got the No One Driving/Glimmer single, so you can see why it would be important to me, at least...

LOL! Oops...

Ah thanks - how could I overlook such a superb release?!

That's true, but I don't have scans of those sleeves, so I guess that's an update for the future...

Thanks!

Maybe not but, I'm guessing Alex is doing UK issues and therefore it was a valid point

There's still a copy of that double single in a small shop in Sheffield... I keep intending to pick it up.

I am sticking to the UK releases on my site, for simplicity's sake.

Lol sorry to be an anorak Alex, Endlessly was also a double pack

My copy of the single is a UK issue. Looks like the one on this page , but slightly less beat up. Strangely enough, the one-disc version and the two-disc version have the same catalogue number, VS 338.

Yeah I remember, though where i was living at the time, the single disc version was rarer than the double pack.

Wouldn't the "My Face Flexi" qualify as a single release too?
Maybe I'm being too pedantic?

Details of the John Foxx gatefold album can also be found here . And all of the versions of No-One Driving that I'm aware of are detailed here .

Rob

Good to see it on the official site. Was there any awareness among UK fans at the time that the record existed? I remember in the past seeing comments about how rare and unknown "My Face" was, when it was on the LP over here.

Yeah, I really ought to start fleshing out the Discography section with all of the stuff I have scanned in. Aside from all of the recent releases, I have at least another forty-odd items to add in. Still, it's not a bad start...

The first I knew about it was when I saw (and immediately bought) a copy of it from a record store in Washington DC back in 1984. I certainly hadn't seen it in the UK. So, as far as I was concerned, it was a real rarity.

Rob

Not at all - it was on the old version of the site - I just don't have a bigger version, as I 'borrowed' that one from ebay but it was tiny.

Ah, I knew I should have hesitated before adding the singles!

Then again, the single pages for Metamatic and The Garden do say "A selection of..."

yea I saw it in HMV, in Glasgow, didn't buy it though as it was too expensive at the time.

Done some more work on the site.

Slightly smaller body font, with much better spacing and a tone darker in colour, since a few people I've shown it to thought white on black (actually it was light grey!) was difficult to read and often 'left an imprint'.

Hopefully it's not too dark now!

My only problem at the moment is the thick fonts I've used for the intro paragraphs, don't always seem to display too well, despite being Arial black.

But I think it looks better than it did, in terms of legibility.

Looks like my No-One Driving singles collection is complete then!

Rob, don't forget to list the edited version that appears on my TOTP transcription disc?

Alex, if your gonna show a piccy of the My Face flexi it has to be shown still taped to the front cover of the appropriate issue of Smash Hits. Happy to oblige if you need a scan

(Nothing wrong with being a pedant )

Lieutenant 030, that would be grand!

The flexi-disc AND Smash Hits - never seen the two together before.

So if you can send me a scan, there's an email link on the links page.

Much appreciated!

Yeah that would be fun. Also see what other articles / featured artists were in it.

Alex, you have post

Great - thanks, I'll look out for it!

Been playing around with the biog page today...

Hi Alex.
Just read your updated biography. It sums up John musical career in a nutshell but without missing any vital points. I like the way you've arranged the text and the photo's.

Peter

Thanks Peter

The text hasn't changed much since the old site - only a little editing and condensing and a new final paragraph.

Today's experiment was more about the layout and integrating pictures with text (or more specifically, trying to get captions in the right place!).

Lieutenant 030 - no mail as yet...

Message was stuck in my outbox. You should have it now.

I like the look of what you've done Alex, but I'd have to agree with and echo E.G .Ekin's comments.

Reproducing photos/factoids and saying 'courtesy of' in a general statement is not the same as having permission. I presume you have permission? - and if so, you should say so.

I hope it doesn't cause you any problems, but I think you need to acknowledge sources for each and every image/piece of information.

Perhaps you could consider making every reference to 'metamatic.com' a hyperlink to this site, especially as you link to your site from here?